Senator SMITH.
I want to fix the hour, and we will pause a moment while your assistants find the hour.
Senator FLETCHER.
Was your cable sent in response to that, or before that?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Our cable was sent without having received this at all.
Senator SMITH.
You gave them the information you had from your Montreal agent about four hours after you got it?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
We did not say this information was from Montreal; we said "reports."
Senator SMITH.
I understand but you got this information from your agent in Montreal about half-past 2 o'clock in the morning?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
No; I said I called up Montreal about half-past 2 in the morning. I had to disconnect, then, and wait until he called me, and when he called me up and I talked over the phone it must have been half-past 3.
Senator SMITH.
All right; we will take that hour. You got the information from your Montreal agent at half-past 3 Monday morning, and you did not communicate with Liverpool or London until 6.15 o'clock Monday morning?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
That is right.
Senator SMITH.
Why did you not communicate with them until 6.15 o'clock?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
As far as I was concerned, I was telephoning in all directions during that time, and then was getting down to the office.
Senator SMITH.
But here was a ship valued at about $7,000,000, and filled with passengers, Britishers as well as Americans, and the chief managing director of your company was aboard the ship?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Right.
Senator SMITH.
Why did you not communicate what information you had, so that they might receive it in the very early morning hours, rather than wait until 10 o'clock?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Because I was doing what I thought was best at the time, to get the best possible information, and get to the office as soon as I could, so I could cable.
Senator SMITH.
I do not want you to infer that I am criticizing you, but I am asking these questions for information.
Mr. FRANKLIN.
It was a question of expediency. I had no idea of sending a cable until I got to the office, and no means of doing so.
Senator SMITH.
But you did give your Liverpool office the first information that it had, and the first information you had?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Yes, sir; and as quick as I could get to the office and collect what information was drifting in from the telephone and by Associated Press reports and otherwise.
Senator SMITH.
I take it you did not sleep very much Sunday night after you got that telephone message from your agent in Montreal?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
I spent the entire time, from 2.20 o'clock until I left the house on the telephone, and then I went to the office; and then I immediately, as promptly as we could; got off these cables and other things.
Senator SMITH.
As a matter of fact, however, if that was the only cable you sent to the London or Liverpool office, you held that information you did have about three hours before you let go of it?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Well I did not hold it in the sense of the word -
Senator SMITH.
I did not mean suppressed it; no.
Mr. FRANKLIN.
I did not cable Liverpool until after we got to the office, and got the offices opened and the people there to cable.
Senator SMITH.
I have not seen any telegram from your London office or Liverpool office asking particularly about the safety of passengers on the Titanic. Have I overlooked it?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
They cabled here -
We have nothing from here or yourselves. Telegraph immediately.
The object of that was to telegraph all the information we could regarding everybody.
Senator SMITH.
What time was that?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
This message here shows that it was received at 20 Broad Street at 5.33 a. m.
Senator SMITH.
Then it was received at 20 Broad Street in New York about an hour before you sent the information to Liverpool?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Yes. But you must remember this, that until we got down to the office and sent messages to each one of the cable companies they would not deliver to us cables until a regularly appointed hour which is about 8 o'clock. Our important cables, and the cable addressed to me, might be delivered to our representative but it would not be delivered to the office, and no other cables would be delivered to the office until about 8 or 8.30 o'clock, and what we did is that we sent around to each cable and telegraph office that we knew was open.
Senator SMITH.
Go ahead.
Mr. FRANKLIN.
All that took a considerable amount of time.
Senator SMITH.
Now I will ask you, with no disposition whatever to affront you, had you advised the cable offices in New York not to deliver those messages to any one but yourself?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Never.
Senator SMITH.
Had you advised them to whom they might deliver them?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Never. Cables and telegrams were coming in all the time, from every source.
Senator SMITH.
But they were not coming in very fast until after the cable company had a right to deliver them at 8 o'clock?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
They would not, because they would not have delivered them to us.
Senator SMITH.
You mean it is the custom of the cable office not to deliver messages which they receive until a certain hour of the morning?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
I think if you will go to the cable management here you will find that the messages for down-town people addressed to cable addresses, which they know perfectly well what they are, are not delivered until they think the offices will be open.
Senator SMITH.
Then messages are held by the cable company to suit the convenience of business men who may not desire be annoyed until they arrive at their offices?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
I would not like to say that, Senator.
Senator SMITH.
That in the effect of it?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
No; I do not think that is the effect of it.
Senator SMITH.
That was the effect of it on this morning, was it not?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Of course, so far as the cable companies are concerned, they would be delivering messages at our office at night if they pursued a different policy.
Senator SMITH.
Oh, no; though I do not want to take issue with you on that.
Mr. FRANKLIN.
The question is this. The cables are coming in from all parts of the world at all hours.
Senator SMITH.
Are any of the officers or directors of the International Mercantile Marine Co., or any of its constituent companies, officers or directors of the cable company?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
I am not sure. I think Mr. Waterbury is a director of some of the telegraph companies and possibly of the cable company; but I am not sure.
Senator SMITH.
Any other officer or director of your company?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Not that I know of.
Senator SMITH.
Mr. Morgan or Mr. Griscom?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
I do not know, at all.
Senator SMITH.
Mr. Steele?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Not to my knowledge.
Senator SMITH.
Your answer refers to -
Mr. FRANKLIN.
That is all the information I have.
Senator SMITH.
Your answer refers to the telegraph companies as well as the cable companies?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Quite.
Senator SMITH.
And does it refer to the wireless companies as well as the telegraph and cable companies?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
It does.
Senator SMITH.
Who is Mr. Waterbury?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Mr. John I. Waterbury is one of our directors. He was president of the Manhattan Trust Co. until recently. He is interested, I think, in some of the telegraph companies, but which companies and how much I have not the slightest idea.
Senator SMITH.
Have you any idea how heavily he is interested, in your company?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
No, sir.
Senator SMITH.
What office does he fill with your company?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Director.
Senator SMITH.
Of the parent company?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
The International Mercantile Marine Co.
Senator SMITH.
Any of the constituent companies?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
No, sir.
Senator SMITH.
Do you know whether Mr. Ismay or any of his associates in the business organization are officers or directors of the cable, telegraph, or wireless companies?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Not to the best of my knowledge and belief.
Senator SMITH.
Do you know whether Mr. Burlingham or Mr. Kirlin is an officer of the cable, telegraph, or wireless companies, or whether they are counsel for any of the companies?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Not to my knowledge. But of course they are here, and you can ask them.
Senator SMITH.
So far as your observations go, Mr. Franklin, you want to be understood as saying there is no community of interest of the senior company or its constituent companies, and the telegraph, cable, or wireless companies?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Absolutely none; and we do not discriminate between any interests at all, in our business.
Senator SMITH.
Have you ever given any directions to the cable offices in New York that cable messages addressed to your company or yourself shall not be delivered until 8 o'clock, or thereabouts, in the morning?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
I could not reply to you definitely on that. It is purely a routine matter. We have certain people or a certain man, set aside to receive communications during the night and on Sundays and holidays. Just exactly what cable messages would go to him, and what hour they would go to him and when they would be delivered at the offices, and when the telegraph companies understand they are to be delivered at the offices, I do not know; I am not prepared to testify, but it is a matter of detail arrangement. We called that man up that night and asked whether he had any information, and he had nothing.
Senator SMITH.
How did you happen to call up Mr. Thom, of Montreal?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Because the report that I got over the telephone was that this information had reached Halifax and Montreal from the steamship Virginian.
Knowing that the steamship Virginian's agents, or the heads of the offices, lived in Montreal, and we having our own representatives in Montreal, I thought I might get some authentic information more quickly and directly by communicating with Montreal than in any other way. That is the reason I called him up.
Senator SMITH.
I do not quite understand your answer to my question as to how you happened to communicate with Mr. Thom. I will detail what I understand it to be to see if I am correct.
You say you communicated with Mr. Thom at Montreal because the steamer Virginian's officers lived in Montreal -
Mr. FRANKLIN. (interrupting)
Her owners live at Montreal.
Senator SMITH.
Her owners live at Montreal, and you telephoned to Montreal about 2 o'clock Monday morning?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
I would say it was after 2, Senator.
Senator SMITH.
After 2 o'clock Monday morning?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Yes, sir.
Senator SMITH.
But at that time you had not received any communication regarding the steamship Virginian? How did you know at that time that the Virginian was related to this matter?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
The very first message or communication that I received was from the newspapers, and I then called up our dock and tried to confirm, and then called up the Associated Press offices. All these reports connected the Virginian with the rumor; that is, the newspapers and Associated Press offices all connected the steamship Virginian with the rumor that they had heard.
Senator SMITH.
I understand.
Senator PERKINS.
You testified yesterday that you telephoned Montreal, and that the report that was given to you by the newspapers was confirmed by Montreal.
Mr. FRANKLIN.
They said that, as far as they could find out, they had the same information in Montreal. Whether our representative was able to get anything absolutely authentic up there, any more than we had, I am not prepared to state, but he confirmed my fear - that is all there was to it - that the rumor was true.
I read into the record the other day that Associated Press report that I had on my desk soon after I got to my office.
Senator SMITH.
Monday morning?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Yes. I read that into the record, and I must have handed the copy to the clerk in charge.
Senator SMITH.
While the chairman is looking through his papers, let me ask you where the Virginian was then, if you can state?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
My recollection in that the Virginian reported that she was 170 miles from the scene of the disaster.
Senator FLETCHER.
Did you make an effort to have the Virginian follow up the information she had and go to the relief of the Titanic?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Our information at that time was that the Virginian was proceeding as rapidly as possible to the Titanic.
Senator FLETCHER.
Did you urge the owners of the Virginian to have her do that?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Our report was that she was proceeding. We did not urge the owners of the Virginian, but we urged our people in Halifax to do their utmost to get in touch with the Parisian, which we also heard was near the scene of the disaster, and also to keep us advised of any information they had.
Senator FLETCHER.
Who are your people in Halifax?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
A. E. Jones & Co., of Halifax.
Senator FLETCHER.
How did you communicate with them?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
By telegram entirely.
Senator FLETCHER.
You urged them to have the Parisian to keep --
Mr. FRANKLIN.
To keep in touch with the Parisian, to see if she had some information about the matter.
Senator FLETCHER.
Did you get any information from Jones & Co.?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Nothing that was worth having.
Senator FLETCHER.
Was there any way you could?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Here are our telegrams with Jones & Co. (indicating). There may be a copy of it. Here is one:
7 a. m. Keep us fully advised any information you get of Titanic. Doing our utmost to get information.
Senator FLETCHER.
Those are the 15th?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
The morning of the 15th of April.
Senator FLETCHER.
Was there any way you could have reached the Virginian through any wireless station that you could command?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
No, sir; because she was proceeding as rapidly as she could to the Titanic.
Senator FLETCHER.
Do you know if the Virginian was in communication with the Carpathia?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
My recollection is that she was, but I could not testify to that. She had the information. She was one of the first ships that had the information.
Senator FLETCHER.
But the Carpathia was nearer the Titanic than the Virginian?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Oh, yes, the Carpathia's captain testified he was 50 miles, it is my recollection, from the Titanic, and my understanding is that the Virginian was 170 miles from the Titanic. We asked Halifax at 7.45 in the morning:
Is there any Government boat or large seagoing tug available to proceed to the Titanic if desired? Answer quickly.
We understood the others were going.
Senator FLETCHER.
Do you know the distance from Halifax to where the Titanic sank?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
Six hundred miles.
Senator SMITH.
Do you or the officers of your company have any responsibility for the employment, or direction of the wireless operators on your boats or on your ships?
Mr. FRANKLIN.
I could not reply to that except in a general way; that is to the effect that I do not think they have. But if anything or anybody was objectionable, I presume he would be removed.