Senator SMITH.
They did not, if you told them to pull toward the ship.
Mr. PITMAN.
They commenced pulling toward the ship, and the passengers in my boat said it was a mad idea on my part to pull back to the ship, because if I did, we should be swamped with the crowd that was in the water, and it would add another 40 to the list of drowned, and I decided I would not pull back.
Senator SMITH.
Officer, you really turned this No. 5 boat around to go in the direction from which these cries came?
Mr. PITMAN.
I did.
Senator SMITH.
And were dissuaded from your purpose by your crew -
Mr. PITMAN.
No, not crew; passengers.
Senator SMITH.
One moment; by your crew and by the passengers in your boat?
Mr. PITMAN.
Certainly.
Senator SMITH.
Then did you turn the boat toward the sea again?
Mr. PITMAN.
No; just simply took our oars in and lay quiet.
Senator SMITH.
You mean you drifted?
Mr. PITMAN.
We may have gone a little bit.
Senator SMITH.
Drifted on your oars?
Mr. PITMAN.
We may have drifted along. We just simply lay there doing nothing.
Senator SMITH.
How many of these cries were there? Was it a chorus, or was it -
Mr. PITMAN.
I would rather you did not speak about that.
Senator SMITH.
I would like to know how you were impressed by it.
Mr. PITMAN.
Well, I can not very well describe it. I would rather you would not speak of it.
Senator SMITH.
I realize that it is not a pleasant theme, and yet I would like to know whether these cries were general and in chorus, or desultory and occasional?
Mr. PITMAN.
There was a continual moan for about an hour.
Senator SMITH.
And you lay in the vicinity of that scene for about an hour?
Mr. PITMAN.
Oh, yes; we were in the vicinity of the wreck the whole time.
Senator SMITH.
And drifted or lay on your oars during that time?
Mr. PITMAN.
We drifted toward daylight, as a little breeze sprang up.
Senator SMITH.
Did this anguish or these cries of distress die away?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes; they died away gradually.
Senator SMITH.
Did they continue during most of the hour?
Mr. PITMAN.
Oh, yes; I think so. It may have been a shorter time. Of course I did not watch every five minutes -
Senator SMITH.
I understand that, and I am not trying to ask about a question of five minutes. Is that all you care to say?
Mr. PITMAN.
I would rather that you would have left that out altogether.
Senator SMITH.
I know you would; but I must know what efforts you made to save the lives of passengers and crew under your charge. If that is all the effort you made, say so -
Mr. PITMAN.
That is all, sir.
Senator SMITH. (continuing)
And I will stop that branch of my examination.
Mr. PITMAN.
That is all, sir; that is all the effort I made.
Senator SMITH.
You spoke of the firemen coming toward the upper deck with their kits or a few things in their hands, saying that the mail room was filling with water.
Mr. PITMAN.
No; no. The fourth officer[Boxhall] told me that the mail room was filling with water. That was previous to seeing the firemen coming up.
Senator SMITH.
These firemen came from the boiler room?
Mr. PITMAN.
Oh, no; from their quarters.
Senator SMITH.
Then they were not on duty?
Mr. PITMAN.
No; those men were not.
Senator SMITH.
These were men that were off duty at that time?
Mr. PITMAN.
Exactly.
Senator SMITH.
Did they come up toward the boat deck?
Mr. PITMAN.
No; they came up from under the forecastle head.
Senator SMITH.
How many were there?
Mr. PITMAN.
I could not say exactly; they were coming up all the time, each man bringing his bundle up.
Senator SMITH.
You said you heard noises like explosions. I would like to know whether you heard any reports that indicated any collapse of the bulkheads?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes; four reports.
Senator SMITH.
I think you said the reports indicated that?
Mr. PITMAN.
There were four reports that I heard that appertained to the bulkheads carrying away.
Senator SMITH.
Do you know whether a failure of the watertight doors to work had anything to do with the boat filling so promptly?
Mr. PITMAN.
No, sir; the watertight doors worked all right.
Senator SMITH.
How do you know that?
Mr. PITMAN.
Because I have seen them working. I saw them working at Belfast.
Senator SMITH.
Before you sailed?
Mr. PITMAN.
Before we sailed.
Senator SMITH.
On the trial test?
Mr. PITMAN.
Before we went on the trial.
Senator SMITH.
I want my associates to know where this lever is, if a lever is used, or where the electric power is that locks these watertight compartments? Where is that operated from; what deck; what part of the boat?
Mr. PITMAN.
The watertight doors are operated from the bridge by a lever close to the wheel.
Senator SMITH.
By whom?
Mr. PITMAN.
By a lever close to the wheel.
Senator SMITH.
I understand, but by whom?
Mr. PITMAN.
Operated by the officer of the watch.
Senator SMITH.
The officer of the watch?
Mr. PITMAN.
Exactly
Senator SMITH.
So if you were officer of the watch when this collision came, it would be your duty to close those doors?
Mr. PITMAN.
Immediately.
Senator SMITH.
I thought I understood you to say that Mr. Murdoch closed those doors, or was that Mr. Boxhall?
Mr. PITMAN.
Mr. Boxhall said that, because he saw it.
Senator SMITH.
You do not know about that yourself?
Mr. PITMAN.
No.
Senator SMITH.
You say you saw those doors operated at Belfast?
Mr. PITMAN.
At Belfast.
Senator SMITH.
Did you see them operated after that?
Mr. PITMAN.
No, sir.
Senator SMITH.
How many were there of those doors?
Mr. PITMAN.
I could not say, sir.
Senator SMITH.
About how many?
Mr. PITMAN.
Of course, they are not all operated by electricity. It is only those in the bottom of the ship that are operated from the bridge.
Senator SMITH.
Those in the bottom of the ship are operated from the bridge?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes, sir.
Senator SMITH.
How are the others opened or closed?
Mr. PITMAN.
By hand.
Senator SMITH.
With a lock and key, and a wrench?
Mr. PITMAN.
By a handle and a spindle.
Senator SMITH.
Are they locked with a key?
Mr. PITMAN.
No one could unlock them without a key or spindle - a brass key.
Senator SMITH.
I understand; but I would like to know whether they are locked with the key, or whether they required a wrench to turn them or unlock them?
Mr. PITMAN.
They require a big wrench - a handle.
Senator SMITH.
Did you see any wrench or key on those watertight compartment doors?
Mr. PITMAN.
They are all kept in a rack close alongside.
Senator SMITH.
Did you see them?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes, sir.
Senator SMITH.
Where?
Mr. PITMAN.
In the passenger accommodations, sir.
Senator SMITH.
At Belfast?
Mr. PITMAN.
At Belfast. They were in the passenger accommodations at sea.
Senator SMITH.
You were quite satisfied they were there?
Mr. PITMAN.
Quite, sir. It was our business to see that all the gear was there.
Senator SMITH.
But you did not see that your lights were on your lifeboats?
Mr. PITMAN.
But we had the lights.
Senator SMITH.
They were not on the boats, or all of them were not, as I understood you. But these watertight compartment keys and wrenches were there in their proper places?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes.
Senator SMITH.
Although you never saw them after leaving Belfast, you knew that they were there then?
Mr. PITMAN.
Because they do not come in our department; they are in the passenger department.
Senator SMITH.
All right; I just wanted to know if you knew about it of your own knowledge. Is there any way for an officer on watch to tell whether the doors actually close when he works the lever from the bridge?
Mr. PITMAN.
No; I do not think there is.
Senator SMITH.
In order to have a perfect test, it would be necessary to have some one below, would it not?
Mr. PITMAN.
I can not say; I am not very well acquainted with those watertight doors. It is the first time that I have been with them
Senator SMITH.
Did you ever operate a lever on a door of a watertight compartment.
Mr. PITMAN.
From the bridge?
Senator SMITH.
Yes.
Mr. PITMAN.
No, sir; never.
Senator SMITH.
But it stands to reason, and your judgment as a navigator is, that operating the lever from the bridge you can not tell with exactness whether the doors have closed below or not?
Mr. PITMAN.
No. Anyhow, the watertight doors were of very little assistance this time.
Senator SMITH.
What do you mean by that?
Mr. PITMAN.
Well, because the ice had ripped the side of the ship out.
Senator SMITH.
The impact was upon which side?
Mr. PITMAN.
The starboard side.
Senator SMITH.
The starboard side; and about how far from the bow?
Mr. PITMAN.
I should say halfway along the ship that her bottom was torn out, or at least her side, along the water.
Senator SMITH.
From the point where this iceberg struck the ship, or the ship struck the iceberg, it ripped the side out?
Mr. PITMAN.
Well, I would say the bilge keel.
Senator SMITH.
For how great a distance?
Mr. PITMAN.
Oh, halfway along the ship.
Senator SMITH.
And that rendered the watertight compartments useless?
Mr. PITMAN.
In that part of the ship, yes.
Senator SMITH.
What is your judgment as to whether, if this impact had occurred bows on -
Mr. PITMAN.
She would have been afloat now.
Senator SMITH. (continuing)
The boat would have survived?
Mr. PITMAN.
Certainly.
Senator SMITH.
Then it was an error to strike it sideways, if it could have been avoided?
Mr. PITMAN.
It was quite natural to try and get out of the way.
Senator SMITH.
Of course I understand that. I am not criticizing that. I am just saying that a ship like that is built for the purpose of meeting the hardest impact at the bow?
Mr. PITMAN.
I do not know. If two or three steamers had run into her she would not have sunk.
Senator SMITH.
If they had run into her bows on?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes; bows on.
Senator SMITH.
But suppose a steamer had hit her at the point of contact where this iceberg hit her, would it have had the same effect?
Mr. PITMAN.
No; it would have required about six steamers to have had the same effect as that iceberg had.
Senator SMITH.
Six steamers of the size of the Titanic?
Mr. PITMAN.
It is immaterial about the size.
Senator SMITH.
Well, tonnage?
Mr. PITMAN.
Irrespective of tonnage.
Senator SMITH.
Do you know what part of the boat flooded first?
Mr. PITMAN.
Apparently the mail room.
Senator SMITH.
Did you have any special report from No. 2 hold, to your knowledge?
Mr. PITMAN.
Not to my knowledge, sir.
Senator SMITH.
Was this mail room on the starboard side?
Mr. PITMAN.
No; it occupied a part of the ship from one side to the other, as I recall.
Senator SMITH.
About the center?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes.
Senator SMITH.
From one side to the other, clear across?
Mr. PITMAN.
As far as I can recollect. I do not remember. I was only down there once myself.
Senator SMITH.
You spoke of the services of Mr. Ismay with the women and children, assisting in loading, etc.
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes.
Senator SMITH.
And did you leave Mr. Ismay on the deck when you were lowered?
Mr. PITMAN.
Mr. Ismay was on the deck when I was lowered, yes. The next I saw of him was coming onto the Carpathia.
Senator SMITH.
You did not see him after you were lowered to the water?
Mr. PITMAN.
Not until morning.
Senator SMITH.
And you say he was dressed, or partially dressed; that he had a dressing gown on?
Mr. PITMAN.
It struck me that he had a dressing gown and pajamas on.
Senator SMITH.
How long did you remain out there by boat No. 5?
Mr. PITMAN.
Just the length of time it took me to get the boat out, and -
Senator SMITH.
Yours was the second boat out?
Mr. PITMAN.
On the starboard side.
Senator SMITH.
And the first boat was on the port side?
Mr. PITMAN.
Oh, no.
Senator SMITH.
Well?
Mr. PITMAN.
I do not know how many boats had gone from the port side. Mine was the first on the starboard side. No. 7 went first, and then No. 5.
Senator SMITH.
Who loaded the first boat?
Mr. PITMAN.
Mr. Murdoch, I think.
Senator SMITH.
Did you assist?
Mr. PITMAN.
I did not.
Senator SMITH.
Did any other officer assist?
Mr. PITMAN.
No; not that I am aware of; I can not say.
Senator SMITH.
Were you standing by when that boat was loaded?
Mr. PITMAN.
No. 5; yes.
Senator SMITH.
No; the first boat.
Mr. PITMAN.
No. 7?
Senator SMITH.
The first one?
Mr. PITMAN.
Oh, no; I was clearing No. 5 at the same time that No. 7 was coming off.
Senator SMITH.
You were clearing No. 5 and some one else was clearing No. 7?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes.
Senator SMITH.
Right next to yours?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes, sir; right next.
Senator SMITH.
Did you see that No. 7 boat manned?
Mr. PITMAN.
No; I had nothing whatever to do with that No. 7 boat.
Senator SMITH.
Do you know who went out in No. 7?
Mr. PITMAN.
No, sir.
Senator SMITH.
Do you know whether Mr. Boxhall went out in it?
Mr. PITMAN.
He did not, sir.
Senator SMITH.
Or Mr. Lightoller?
Mr. PITMAN.
There was no officer in that boat, because I had it made fast to mine for some time after we got away from the ship.
Senator SMITH.
Was it lowered at the same time yours was lowered?
Mr. PITMAN.
Two or three minutes previously.
Senator SMITH.
Then, can you say whether Mr. Ismay was in boat No. 7?
Mr. PITMAN.
I know he was not, for he came off from a collapsible boat.
Senator SMITH.
And this boat, No. 7, was a full-sized lifeboat?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes, sir.
Senator SMITH.
And yours was No. 5. Do you know whether there were more men than women in boat No. 7?
Mr. PITMAN.
I can not say.
Senator SMITH.
But there was no officer in No. 7?
Mr. PITMAN.
No officer in No. 7.
Senator SMITH.
Do you know how many sailors there were in No. 7?
Mr. PITMAN.
I do not, sir.
Senator SMITH.
Did you ever see No. 7 after it struck the water?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes; I had it made fast to me. As there was no officer in the boat I said, "Look here, make fast to me and we will hang on until daylight, as it is smooth water, and at daylight we will set our sails, and we will be more likely to be picked up if we are together than if one of us is over there and one over here."
Senator SMITH.
After making fast, you attached the bow of No. 7 to the stern of No. 5 by a rope?
Mr. PITMAN.
By a rope - a painter.
Senator SMITH.
And how close did you bring No. 7 up to No. 5?
Mr. PITMAN.
We were alongside, close alongside of each other for some time; side by side for some time.
Senator SMITH.
In that situation did you notice how many of the crew of the Titanic were in that boat?
Mr. PITMAN.
I could not say, sir; it was too dark.
Senator SMITH.
Did you notice whether that lifeboat was filled with people?
Mr. PITMAN.
I do not think there were quite so many in there as in my boat. I am not sure.
Senator SMITH.
Would you be willing to say that there were more than 25 in there?
Mr. PITMAN.
Oh, yes.
Senator SMITH.
How many more?
Mr. PITMAN.
I would say there were over 30, between 30 and 40, in there.
Senator SMITH.
Between 30 and 40, in your judgment?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes, sir.
Senator SMITH.
Did anyone on your lifeboat or on the other lifeboat count those people?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes, we did count them, but I forget how many were really in that boat. I transferred a woman and child and two men from my boat into that boat.
Senator SMITH.
After you had attached them, you balanced up the load?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes, sir.
Senator SMITH.
So that there was really room in No. 7 for more people than were taken when it was lowered to the water?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes, they could have taken a few more.
Senator SMITH.
How many more, with safety?
Mr. PITMAN.
Well, that would depend a great deal on the condition of the water.
Senator SMITH.
I know, but we have concluded that the water was smooth and the weather all right. Under those circumstances, with pleasant weather all the way, how many would that lifeboat hold safely?
Mr. PITMAN.
They are all supposed to contain sixty people.
Senator SMITH.
But none of them did contain 60?
Mr. PITMAN.
I can not say that, sir.
Senator SMITH.
These two boats, No. 7 and No. 5, did not contain 60 people each?
Mr. PITMAN.
No. They could have taken more, but there were no women around at the time those boats were lowered.
Senator SMITH.
And no men?
Mr. PITMAN.
There may have been a few men around there.
Senator SMITH.
Were there?
Mr. PITMAN.
There were some; yes, sir.
Senator SMITH.
Why were they not taken?
Mr. PITMAN.
I can not say why they were not taken in No. 7, but I thought I had sufficient in my boat for safety in lowering.
Senator SMITH.
Is there any danger in lowering a lifeboat with the davits and other equipment operating? Is there such danger in lowering a lifeboat that you can not fill it to its capacity?
Mr. PITMAN.
I would not like to fill a lifeboat with 60 people and lower it suspended at both ends.
Senator SMITH.
Did you ever see 60 people in a lifeboat?
Mr. PITMAN.
No; I can not say that I have, although I think some of them had close on to 60 when they came alongside the Carpathia.
Senator SMITH.
Did you hear Mr. Bride, the wireless telegrapher of the Titanic, testify?
Mr. PITMAN.
No, sir.
Senator SMITH.
Did you hear Mr. Lightoller testify?
Mr. PITMAN.
No, sir.
Senator SMITH.
Mr. Lightoller said that on the collapsible lifeboat, turned over bottom side up, there were 35 people. If a collapsible lifeboat, overturned, can accommodate 35 people sitting unprotected, what would be your judgment as to the capacity of a lifeboat such as No. 5 or No. 7, floating in its customary way; would 60 people be the limit?
Mr. PITMAN.
I should think so, sir. There is no room to move with 60 in it.
Senator SMITH.
No room to move?
Mr. PITMAN.
No, sir. She would support a lot more if she was capsized, and people in the water just holding onto her, of course.
Senator SMITH.
I want to call attention again to what I suppose you may dislike me to return to, but I want to know, because I want the record to disclose the fact. At what time after you left the Titanic was No. 7 lifeboat attached to No. 5?
Mr. PITMAN.
It may have been from 1 to half-past 2.
Senator SMITH.
How much of the hour that you lay on your oars were these two boats together?
Mr. PITMAN.
It may have been an hour and it may have been two.
Senator SMITH.
That you were together?
Mr. PITMAN.
That we were together; yes.
Senator SMITH.
That is, before you were picked up by the Carpathia?
Mr. PITMAN.
Oh, yes. We had cast off before the Carpathia came in sight.
Senator SMITH.
You had separated from one another?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes.
Senator SMITH.
But you were fastened together how long?
Mr. PITMAN.
Maybe two hours. I am not quite certain about that.
Senator SMITH.
Two hours? During those two hours you took some people out of your boat and put them into the other boat?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes. That is correct.
Senator SMITH.
Three people, as I understood you; men or women?
Mr. PITMAN.
Both, and a child.
Senator SMITH.
How many men?
Mr. PITMAN.
I think two men, a lady, and a child.
Senator SMITH.
Four people?
Mr. PITMAN.
I think so.
Senator SMITH.
And you took them out and put them into this No. 7 boat?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes.
Senator SMITH.
When you were doing that, were you aware of the fact that there were cries of distress, and many people were in the water near by?
Mr. PITMAN.
No; there were not then. The ship had not disappeared then.
Senator SMITH.
When this was done the ship had not disappeared?
Mr. PITMAN.
No.
Senator SMITH.
And these cries were not heard by you at that time?
Mr. PITMAN.
No. There were no cries at that time, or until after the ship had disappeared.
Senator SMITH.
And you did not transfer these four passengers after the ship went down?
Mr. PITMAN.
Oh, no. Some time before the ship disappeared.
Senator SMITH.
And then was No. 7 released?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes. They slipped my rope.
Senator SMITH.
What did you do then?
Mr. PITMAN.
I simply lay still, just as we were.
Senator SMITH.
You just lay still, there?
Mr. PITMAN.
Yes, sir.
Senator SMITH.
Did you see the light of the Carpathia, or know she was approaching?
Mr. PITMAN.
We saw her lights about half-past 3, as near as I can recollect.
Senator SMITH.
Did you row toward the light?
Mr. PITMAN.
Well, we waited until we were certain it was a steamer, and then we pulled toward her.
Senator SMITH.
How far away did you see her, do you think?
Mr. PITMAN.
We could see the masthead light over 5 miles on a clear night.
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