1st cabin passenger,
Empress of Ireland,
Sworn.
By Mr. Newcombe:
2290. Mr. Smart, you were a first cabin passenger on the Empress of Ireland on the voyage on which she sank?
- Yes, sir
2291. What was the number of your cabin?
- Well, as well as I can remember, it was 212. It was on the dining-room deck
2292. Can you identify it on the plan?
Lord Mersey:
Let him tell us whether it was on the port side or the starboard side.
By Mr. Newcombe:
2293. It was on the starboard side of the ship?
- Starboard side of the ship.
By Lord Mersey:
2294. On the dining saloon deck?
- Yes.
2295. Was it near amidships?
- Yes, quite near.
By Mr. Newcombe:
2296. At what time did you turn in?
- Between 9.30 and 10.
2299. [sic] Were you awakened by the collision?
- No, I was awakened by the siren or the whistles blowing.
2298. Do you know what time that was?
- It must have been very nearly 2 o’clock.
2299. What did you hear?
- I heard a sort of double whistle, two whistles at a time, two distressing calls, like.
2300. What did you do?
- I sat up in bed and cogitated for a moment; then suddenly the crash came.
2301. So that you were awakened before the collision took place?
- I was awakened before the collision, yes.
2302. Then what did you do?
- I ran out of my stateroom into the passage-way and climbed up on a little box or some arrangement there and looked out the port hole.
2303. What did you see?
- I saw the bow of the Storstad. I saw some men on deck and heard the captain of the Empress talking to them.
2304. Did you hear what he said?
- The Captain of the Empress said: Go ahead, or words to that effect, or to keep going.
2305. Did you hear any reply from the Storstad?
- No, no reply.
By Lord Mersey:
2306. You did not hear any?
- I did not hear any reply from the Captain of the Storstad.
By Chief Justice McLeod:
2307. The collision had then taken place?
- Yes.
By Mr. Newcombe:
2308. You were very close to the Storstad?
- Yes, it seems to me that I was exceedingly close. My recollection is, although it is an exaggeration, that I could almost have touched the bow of the Storstad, because she was straight in against the side of the ship. I think this is exaggeration; of course, it is very difficult for one to tell. I would not like to say I could, but that is the impression that is in my mind.
2309. Where was the port hole you were looking out; was it forward or abaft, the point of contact?
- I cannot say that.
By Lord Mersey:
2310. Can you say whether the bow of the Storstad that you say you saw, was to your right or left hand side?
- I would say it was to my right.
2311. That is to say, the bow of the Storstad was further astern, to your right?
- Possibly, but I would not like to say.
By Mr. Newcombe:
2312. What did you do then?
- I ran back to my cabin, put on my trousers and coat over my pyjamas and went up on deck.
2313. Did you get a life belt?
- No.
2314. Were there life belts there?
- Yes, but I did not realize the danger that we were in.
2315. You went on deck?
- I went on deck, yes.
2316. What did you find on deck?
- I found general confusion, but not a panic, you know. The people were rushing to the upper deck, the deck above me. I realized at once when I got out on deck that I had no life belt, and I just made up my mind I had to trust Providence for safety.
2317. You came out on the starboard side of the ship?
- Yes.
2318. Did you cross the deck to the port rail?
- Yes, I sat on the railing of the ship.
2319. Any difficulty in getting up there on account of the list of the ship?
- Yes, very great difficulty, it was almost, I would say, a 40 per cent grade
By Lord Mersey:
2320. There was a great list to starboard?
- Very great; in fact, I had to crawl on my hands and knees over the stairs from the saloon deck to the upper deck to get out.
By Mr. Newcombe:
2321. You got on the rail?
- I climbed out on the rail and put my arm around the post, you know, and just sat and waited.
2322. Until the ship went down?
- Until the ship went down. When the ship went down, it appears to me I went over with her as I was shot out.
2323. And you were picked up?
- Yes. I went down twice, fully 10 or 20 feet, I imagine, and when I came up the second time I saw a dark object in the water. I put forth every herculean effort until I gripped with one hand a deck chair. I hung on to that until I got very weak and I pulled the chair up to about here with my hands out this way (indicating), and I rested. I must have drifted around fully-an hour, because it was seven o’clock when they dropped me at Rimouski.
2324. What boat did you get into? Were you on the Storstad?
- No, I was on the Lady Evelyn, I think. Of course I won’t be positive as to that because I was not in a state to -
2325. About, the discipline on board after the collision, as far as you could observe; have you anything to say about that?
- Yes, it was really marvellous. I never heard people who spoke with such tenderness to each other in that time of great distress and danger as there were there. There was no bad language, no panic to speak of.
2326. No violence at all?
- No violence at all; all good-natured. On the life raft, the man in charge of the raft, whoever he was I will never know, but whoever he was he spoke in the kindest way to me; it was really delightful to me then under those trying circumstances.
2327. Now, when you came on deck, you were there holding on to the rail for several minutes before the ship went down?
- Yes, it must have been for some minutes.
2328. Are you able to say whether the Empress was moving through the water at the time?
- No. My impression was that she had stopped, but she might have been moving just very gradually.
2329. You are satisfied that she was moving very slowly, if at all?
- If at all.
2330. Is there anything which you wish to add to this statement, Mr. Smart?
- No, I think that is the sum and substance, without elaborating on my experience.
2331. About an explosion; did you hear anything of that?
- No, but I heard somebody call to me: the ship is on fire, and I just turned my head and looked around and I saw great flames of smoke coming out of one of the pipes. Of course I did not care at that time what was happening.
By Lord Mersey:
2332. When you put your head out of the port, which, as I understand was in the passage, not in your cabin?
- It was in the passage.
2333. And saw the stem of the Storstad, as far as you can tell us were the two ships at that moment in contact?
- They were not touching each other.
2334. They were not?
- No.
2335. And the collision had taken place?
- It had taken place before I had got in that position.
Cross-examined by Mr. Haight:
2336. Mr. Smart, when you were awakened by the sound of the whistles that you characterized as distressing, did you distinguish how many blasts there were? Were you able to tell that they were blowing a real distress signal, four or five or six short blasts, or whether it was of another kind?
- My impression is that there were two whistles, two blasts at a time. Of course, it might have been repeated, you know.
2337. Were they blown on a siren?
- Well, I presume so.
2338. I mean, was the sound one which rose to a crescendo, and like a running whistle?
- Yes, like a scream, you know.
2339. It was not an ordinary single tone blast?
- No.
2340. The usual fog whistle?
- No, it was a double, - there were two blasts.
Lord Mersey:
He has said that it was a siren; I understood him to say so.
The Witness:
Perhaps I am mistaken in saying so, but I assumed that it was.
By Mr. Haight:
2341. As I understand, you felt the jar of the actual contact before you looked out the port hole?
- Yes.
2342. Had the jar come after you got out of your berth?
- No, just as I was getting out. As soon as the first impact came, I jumped out.
2343. And you stopped only to throw on a coat over your pyjamas?
- A coat and my trousers.
2344. That took only a few seconds?
- Yes.
2345. When you looked out of the port hole, as I understand you, the vessels seemed to be relatively at right angles?
- Yes.
2346. But the stem of the Storstad was then a little distant from the side of the Empress?
- The bow of the Storstad, yes.
2347. You said that she was so close that you felt you could almost touch her?
- Yes, I felt that, you know, afterwards. It seemed to me she was so close I could almost touch her and I could distinguish men on deck.
2348. So that the bow should only have been a foot or two -
Lord Mersey:
Do not argue about it, please; ask him questions and take his answers.
By Mr. Haight:
2349. Now, what would you judge to be the distance between the side of the Empress and the bow when you looked at her and thought you could touch her?
- I would not like to say.
Lord Mersey:
You are quite right not to say.
By Mr. Haight:
2350. How soon did you go on deck after you looked out?
- I would not like to define any time.
2351. Did you start to do anything else?
- No.
2352. Went from the port hole straight on deck?
- No, I went back to my stateroom and put on my coat and my trousers and then went for the deck.
2353. I thought you had your trousers on before you came out of the room?
- No, I was in my pyjamas.
2354. When you went to look through the port hole, you said you had thrown on a coat?
- No, I ran out and looked through the port hole before I put on either coat or trousers. I ran back and put them on when I saw the position of the ships.
2355. When you started to go up on deck, the Empress was already listing so far that you had to crawl up the stairs?
- Yes, had to crawl up the stairs.
By Lord Mersey:
2356. After you went back to your cabin to put on your coat and trousers, and when you crawled up on deck, where was the Storstad, do you know?
- No, I do not know.
2357. Do not tell me if you don’t know?
- I do not know, because I was on the other side.
Lord Mersey:
That is quite enough.
The Witness:
I don’t know; she struck on the starboard side; I took the higher side of the ship.
By Lord Mersey:
2358. You took the port side?
- The port side.
2359. Which you thought was the safest?
- The safest, yes.
By Mr. Haight:
2360. Can you form any idea, Mr. Smart, as to how long you sat on the port rail before the vessel went over and you went in the water?
- No, I would not undertake to do that; some minutes probably.
By Lord Mersey:
2361. To you it might have seemed an eternity?
- It is impossible to measure time under the circumstances.
By Mr. Haight:
2362. Will you state how much of a jar there was when the vessels came together. Were you shaken up seriously?
- No, I can best define the jar by saying that it reminded me of the rude impact of a couple of coaches on a railway when they almost knock you over with the impact. They make very rough couplings sometimes, you know. It reminded me very much of that.
2363. Did you see the Storstad after you looked out through the port hole?
- Yes, I think -
2361. I mean, before you went in the water?
- Yes, I think I did.
2365. Where did you see her?
- I assume it was the Storstad. There was
a ship standing, it appears to me to have been quite a distance out, possibly a mile, all electrically lighted. I saw her in the distance. I sat on the railing before the ship went down. Before the Empress went down I saw in the distance this lighted ship.
2366. Which way was she from you?
- I would not undertake to say.
2367. You do not know whether she was towards your stern or towards your bow?
- No, I would not like to pass any opinion as to that.
2368. Was it foggy then?
- There was a slight fog, I think, very light. It reminded me something of the land, a misty morning, you know.
2369. What is your business, Mr. Smart?
- I am -
Lord Mersey:
What does that matter?
Mr. Haight:
I do not know’ that it matters anything, my Lord, but I should like to ask the question if I am permitted.
Lord Mersey:
But I do not think that inquiring as to this gentleman’s personal affairs will help us. Does it go to his credit?
Mr. Haight:
I do not think it will, sir.
Lord Mersey:
If it does not go to his credit, it is certainly not material. I am simply interrupting you in the interest, though I am not sure that I am accomplishing what I want to do, of economy and time. I am not sure that I am doing it.
Mr. Haight:
Possibly, if he were an engineer -
Lord Mersey:
Perhaps it would be shorter to allow you to ask the immaterial question and get the answer.
The Witness:
I am not ashamed of my occupation. I am Chief Inspector of British Immigrant Children of Canada, Dominion Civil Service.
By Mr. Newcombe:
2370. Service of the Dominion Government?
- Service of the Dominion Government.
Lord Mersey:
(to Mr. Gibsone). Do you want to ask anything?
Mr. Gibsone:
No, My Lord
By Mr. Newcombe:
2371. Do you remember whether 212 was the number of your cabin?
- I am not positively certain, you know. I got the location, anyway, of my room, and I knew where to find it. It was along the saloon passageway, just a very short distance.
By Mr. Haight:
2372. The passenger list will show?
- Yes. They changed me after I was on the ship. When I went on first I was in one room and they gave me a stateroom to the south afterwards, right adjoining the one I had been assigned to.
2373. How near to the one originally assigned to you?
- Just a partition between us, that was all.
(Witness retired.)