(Further examined by Senator Perkins - Testimony taken as a group.)
Senator PERKINS.
Is there any other one of
you who has been in a shipwreck?
Mr. HOGG.
I have been in a collision, Senator, but with no loss of life.
Senator PERKINS.
On the lookout in the crow's nest did you see any ice?
Mr. HOGG.
No, sir; I never seen any ice when I relieved that lookout.
Senator PERKINS.
Were instructions given you to keep a sharp lookout?
Mr. HOGG.
When I relieved the lookout at 12 o'clock that night I had instructions from my relief.
Senator PERKINS.
You men have all had experience, more or less, as lookouts. Is it customary to furnish you with night glasses?
Mr. HOGG.
We never had night glasses.
Senator PERKINS.
Just the naked eye?
Mr. HOGG.
Just the naked eye. I have always had night glasses in the White Star boats. I asked for the glasses, and I did not see why I should not have them. I had them from Belfast to Southampton; but from Southampton to where the accident occurred we never had them.
Senator PERKINS.
You were instructed to report immediately to the officer on the bridge anything that occurred or any object on the horizon?
Mr. HOGG.
No, sir. I asked for the glasses several times.
Senator PERKINS.
What were your instructions when you went into the crow's nest, given to you by the officer?
Mr. HOGG.
None; but my opposite member gave me instructions, "Keep a sharp lookout for ice."
Senator PERKINS.
When you saw the ice ahead, you struck three bells?
Mr. HOGG.
The last lookout, the 6 to 8, was my lookout.
Senator PERKINS.
That is the last dog watch.
Mr. HOGG.
I got a warning, then, to keep a sharp lookout for ice, and I said, "Very good."
Senator PERKINS.
Did you discover any ice?
Mr. HOGG.
None, sir. It was very, very cold, and I said "There is plenty of ice about here, because it is so cold." That is what I said to my mate.
Senator PERKINS.
How far is the foremast, that the crow's nest is on, from the bridge? What is the distance.
Mr. HOGG.
I am not good at judging distances, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
You know pretty nearly? This room, perhaps, is 30 feet long. Was it as far as from this door to that window (indicating)?
Mr. HOGG.
I could not swear to that. I should think, however, that it was about 50 feet. That is what I should think about it. I could not swear to it.
Senator PERKINS.
There was a telephone from the crow's nest to the officer on the bridge?
Mr. HOGG.
Yes, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
Was the telephone always in working order?
Mr. HOGG.
The telephone was in working order; yes, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
And where they had no telephone, then you hailed, with calls to the bridge?
Mr. HOGG.
No, sir; we struck a bell. We never used the phone, only in going into harbors, or into ports, or in the case of anything serious.
Senator PERKINS.
And you struck the bell every half hour?
Mr. HOGG.
Yes. And for reporting ships you struck one, port; two, starboard; and three, right ahead.
Senator PERKINS.
That is your signal to the bridge, which is understood, of course?
Mr. HOGG.
Yes, sir; that is the signal that you have seen something.
Senator PERKINS.
Yes.
Can either one of you men suggest anything by which this accident could have been avoided, or by which more lives could have been saved? You are all good sailormen, and have had large experience. Could anything have been done to save more lives than were saved?
Mr. HOGG.
No, sir. The only thing I can suggest is in regard to the glasses. If we had had the glasses, we might have seen the berg before?
Senator PERKINS.
The officers on the bridge had glasses?
Mr. HOGG.
They had, yes, sir.
Mr. SYMONS.
It is always customary to have glasses in the crow's nest.
Senator PERKINS.
That has been the custom of the White Star Line?
Mr. SYMONS.
Yes. I served three years and five months on the Oceanic, and they had glasses all the time.
Senator PERKINS.
Did she belong to the White Star Line?
Mr. SYMONS.
Yes, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
Also in regard to other ships, do you know?
Mr. SYMONS.
As far as I have heard from other people, they have glasses in all the other ships.
Senator PERKINS.
Your eyes were tested, were they?
Mr. SYMONS.
Last September they were tested by the board of trade by the new test, the latest test out.
Senator PERKINS.
They gave you a certificate that you were qualified as a good lookout?
Mr. SYMONS.
Yes, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
And it was the same way with both of you men?
Mr. HOGG.
Yes; about two months ago, I think, my eyes were tested.
Senator PERKINS.
In an ordinary way, can you not see better with your plain eyes than you can with artificial glasses?
Mr. HOGG.
But the idea of the glasses, sir, is that if you happen to see something on the horizon you can pick your ship out, if it is a ship, for instance.
Senator PERKINS.
As soon as you see anything, you signal the officer on the bridge, do you not?
Mr. HOGG.
Yes, sir; you would strike the bell. But you would make sure, if you had the glasses that it was a vessel and not a piece of cloud on the horizon.
On a very nice night, with the stars shining, sometimes you might think it was a ship when it was a star on the horizon. If you had glasses, you could soon find out whether it was a ship or not.
Senator SMITH.
As soon as you discover anything unusual, however, you call the attention of the officer on the bridge to it, do you not?
Mr. HOGG.
Quite so.
Senator PERKINS.
And he had glasses, of course?
Mr. HOGG.
He has glasses, sir; yes sir.
Senator PERKINS.
Is there anything that you want to state the could have been done to save these people, aside from that?
Mr. HOGG.
That is all that I can suggest.
Senator PERKINS.
If you had had life rafts on board more could have been saved, could they not?
Mr. HOGG.
If we had had more boats I dare say that we could have got away with a lot more.
Senator PERKINS.
The general feeling, though, you said, was that the ship was safe, and that she was not going to sink. What was the general opinion that prevailed as to the seaworthiness of the ship?
Mr. HOGG.
I should say that I never thought she was going to sink. I went to relieve the lookout 20 minutes after accident. I thought she was not going down.
Senator PERKINS.
There was a general feeling of confidence among the sailormen that she was perfectly secure?
Mr. HOGG.
Yes, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
And unsinkable?
Mr. HOGG.
Yes, sir; that she was unsinkable.
Senator PERKINS.
Unless you have something more to state that you think will throw light on this subject, that will be all; and we thank you for what you have said.
Mr. HOGG.
That is all I have to say, except this: I think all the women ought to have a gold medal on their breasts. God bless them. I will always raise my hat to a woman, after what I saw.
Senator PERKINS.
What country women were they?
Mr. HOGG.
They were American women that I had in mind. They were all Americans.
Senator PERKINS.
Did they man the oars? Did they take the oars and pull?
Mr. HOGG.
Yes, sir. I took the oar all the time, myself, and one lady steered. Then I got another lady to steer, and she gave me a hand on the oar, to keep herself warm.
Senator PERKINS.
One of the boats picked up a lot of people that were on the upturned collapsible boat? [Collapsible B]
Mr. HOGG.
I did not see that. I believe that is so.
Senator PERKINS.
You people had no buoy, nor anything but the life preservers that you picked up?
Mr. HOGG.
That is all.
Senator PERKINS.
Is there anything else that you can think of, any recommendation or suggestion that you have to make? If so, we would like to have you do so.
Mr. HOGG.
That is all, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
I say that because you are good practical men, and have had a great deal of experience.
I thank you very much. We will excuse you now. That is all. Tomorrow morning we will take up this matter, and probably you can go home. You want to go home to England, all of you, do you?
Mr. HOGG.
Yes, sir; we are all married men, waiting to get back home.
Senator PERKINS.
Are you a married man, Mr. Symons?
Mr. SYMONS.
No, sir; but I have my mother and father waiting for me.
Senator PERKINS.
You are a married man, Mr. Hogg?
Mr. HOGG.
Yes, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
And you have a wife and children?
Mr. HOGG.
Yes, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
How many children?
Mr. HOGG.
Two, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
You home is in Hull, also?
Mr. HOGG.
All my people are there, but my wife is in Southampton. I make Southampton my home now. I married a Hampshire woman.
Senator PERKINS.
I think you very much for your statement.
There is one other thing I wanted to ask. Are you all temperate men? I want to ask whether there was any drunkenness among any of the crew?
Mr. SYMONS.
None whatever, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
You are personally acquainted with the habits of the crew. Were there any drinking men among them?
Mr. SYMONS.
We never allowed it to be served on board the ship, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
No liquor whatever was allowed to be served to them?
Mr. SYMONS.
No, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
There was none in the forecastle or in the mess room with you?
Mr. SYMONS.
No, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
You never saw a man under the influence of liquor on the voyage?
Mr. HOGG.
No, sir; I do not see where they could get it from.
Senator PERKINS.
None was permitted or allowed on board?
Mr. HOGG.
No, sir.
Senator PERKINS.
One of you has stated that his boat picked up eight people and the other that he did not pick up any. Could you not have picked up some people just as well as this other man? Could you not have done it just as well as this other man?
Mr. HOGG.
I wanted to assist in picking up people, but I had an order from the boat: "We have done our best; go on to the Carpathia; we have picked up all we can find;" and I said "Very good."
Senator PERKINS.
Who gave you that order?
Mr. HOGG.
Somebody in the boat - I do not know who it was - said not to take any more, that we had done our best.
Senator PERKINS.
I merely asked the question because of the natural thought that if one boat picked up eight persons, the other boat might have been able to do so.
You did not get any orders, Mr. Symons, not to pick up any more people?
Mr. SYMONS.
No, sir; there were no more around about where I was.
Senator PERKINS.
Were those two boats the same size?
Mr. HOGG.
They were the same size.
Senator PERKINS.
As I understand, one of the boats had more packed into it than the other.
As I understand it, Mr. Symons pulled away from the ship; and then, when he came back there, they picked up all the people there were around.
(Witnesses Excused.)
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