(Mr. Lightoller was sworn by the chairman.)
600. (Senator Smith.) What is your name?
- Charles Herbert Lightoller.
601. Mr. Lightoller, where do you reside?
- Netley Abbey, Hampshire.
602. England?
- England.
603. How old are you?
- Thirty-eight.
604. What is your business?
- Seaman.
605. How long have you been in the service or employment?
- Thirteen years and three months.
606. How extensive has been your service in that time?
- I do not quite follow you.
607. How much service have you seen? In what capacities?
- In all the capacities in the White Star service - fourth, third, second, and first officer.
608. You have been in the White Star service during all of that time?
- Yes, sir.
609. What official positions have you held?
- Fourth, third, second, and first officer.
610. What position do you occupy now?
- Second officer of the Titanic.
611. How long have you been second officer?
- Altogether, about seven years.
612. When did you go aboard the Titanic?
- In Belfast.
613. When?
- March 19 or 20.
614. Did you make the so-called trial trips?
- Yes, sir.
615. Of what did they consist?
- Turning circles and adjusting compasses.
616. In what waters?
- Belfast Lough.
617. How extensive is that lough?
- I can hardly say offhand without seeing a chart.
618. Have you any data here that shows?
- No.
619. Just state as nearly as you can.
- It may be about 15 miles long, widening out from a few miles wide to perhaps 7 miles. That is only approximate, sir.
620. Have you ever been in that water before?
- Only passing through.
621. How did you happen to pass through it?
- Going into Belfast or coming out bound to some port. I do not mean in an official capacity; as a passenger. I have been through it in an official capacity about 11 years ago.
622. Is that water usually selected for these trial tests for new ships?
- Yes.
623. What was the condition of the weather when you made this trial test?
- Light breeze, clear weather, sir.
624. From the time you boarded the Titanic did you at any time encounter any rough weather?
- No, sir.
625. You were always in smooth water, so-called?
- Yes, sir.
626. Does that include up to the time of this collision?
- Yes, sir.
627. Of what do these trial tests consist?
- Turning circles.
628. I wish you would describe that a little more fully. Under what head of steam and how fast would the boat be moving?
- Under various speeds.
629. In how large a radius would these circles be made?
- Turning circles consists of seeing in what space the ship will turn under certain helms with the engines at various speeds.
630 Was this boat tested at its maximum speed?
- That I could not say, sir.
631. What was the maximum speed of this boat?
- That I could not say, sir. She was never put, to my knowledge, to her maximum speed.
632. What did you understand it to be?
- About 22 1/2 to 23 knots.
633. From whom did you get that information?
- General rumor, sir
634. Did you talk with the boat's officers?
- From talk generally; yes. It was only an approximate idea.
635. How much time was spent in the test?
- I could not say exactly.
636. Approximately?
- About five hours.
637. During that time those circles were made?
- Yes, sir.
638. And the ship reversed?
- Yes, sir.
639. And put on a straight course?
- Yes, sir.
640. And under full head?
- I could not say, sir. She steamed for a certain distance under approximately a full head of steam; but how much steam was on I could not say, or what pressure of steam.
641. How many engines were there in this boat?
- Two reciprocating and one turbine.
642. Were they all working on the trial test?
- So far as I know, sir.
643. What do you know about that? Were you in the engine room?
- No, sir; I was on my station, aft.
644. Where was your station?
- The after-end of the ship.
645. Then you would not, of your own knowledge, know whether its entire power was being tested out or not?
- I should not; no, sir.
646. Five hours was the length of time spent in making those tests?
- Approximately the length of time occupied in turning those circles.
647. What was the next thing that was done with the ship?
- She was run a certain distance on a comparatively straight course and back again.
648. How far?
- I could not say without a chart, sir.
649. How long did it take you?
- Approximately four hours.
650. To make the straight run?
- Yes, sir.
651. And return?
- And return.
652. Four hours all together, two out and two back?
- Two out and two back. That is only approximate.
653. Would you think from what you observed in the movements of this ship that it was going pretty fast?
- For a ship of that size, a fair speed.
654. Fair speed?
- A fair speed.
655. What would you call real good speed?
- When the ship was built, we only expected her to go 21 knots, therefore all over 21 we thought very good.
656. This ship exceeded 21 knots?
- On the trials? I am not speaking of the trials. I do not know what the speed was; I have no idea.
657. I understand you to say that you expected to get 2l knots out of her?
- The builders, I presume, to get 21.
658. That was the general rumor?
- Yes.
659. Among the officers?
- Yes.
660. I suppose that was the hope, too, of the officers?
- Exactly.
661. What boat had you been on before you went on board the Titanic?
- The Oceanic.
662. The Oceanic, of the same line?
- Of the same line.
663. How large a boat is the Oceanic?
- Seventeen thousand tons gross.
664. Do you know her maximum speed?
- Twenty-one knots.
665. I want to be sure I get the results of these trial tests accurately. I want you to tell me how long it took to make these tests. The straightaway tests and the circle tests altogether consumed how much time?
- Approximately six or seven hours. I could not say any nearer than that.
666. What time of day did you begin these tests?
- In the morning.
667. How early?
- About 10 o'clock.
668. Was it clear weather?
- Perfectly clear.
669. Was there any sea?
- Very little.
670. And after about seven hours the tests were concluded?
- With the exception of full speed astern; that is to see in what distance the ship will stop with the engines full speed astern - what we call the full speed astern test.
671. Was that made that day?
- Yes, sir.
672. How long did that take?
- That was only the matter of minutes.
673. A few minutes?
- A few minutes.
674. Do you know who was aboard the Titanic in these trial tests?
- A great number. I know some of them.
675. Please state those that you know.
- Capt. Smith; Mr. Murdoch, chief officer; myself, first officer; Mr. Blair, second officer; Mr. Pitman, third officer; Mr. Boxhall, fourth officer; Mr. Lowe, fifth officer; Mr. Moody, sixth officer; and Mr. Andrews, of Harland & Wolff.
676. Representing the builders?
- Yes, sir. I could not say anyone else with any accuracy.
677. Who was the chief engineer?
- Mr. Bell, chief engineer; Mr. Ferguson [Farquharson], second engineer; Mr. Hesketh, also second. That is all I know.
678. How many men constituted the crew?
- Seamen, you are speaking of?
679. Yes.
- About 71 all told; officers and crew.
680. And seamen?
- Yes, sir.
681. On the trial test?
- Oh, no, sir. I am not speaking of the trial.
682. How many men constituted the crew on the trial tests?
- About 30 of the crew and about 30 of what we call runners.
683. Were there any guests on the boat?
- I believe there were; I could not say who.
684. Do you know who they were?
- No, sir.
685. Were there any of the officers of the White Star Line?
- I could not say with certainty, sir.
686. You do not recall seeing any of them?
- I do not recall; no, sir. I believe there were some on board; but I can not remember who they were. I was not brought in contact with them.
687. Was Mr. Ismay aboard?
- Not to my knowledge, sir.
688. Did you hear afterwards that he was on board?
- No, sir.
689. You can not recall any officer of the company that was?
- No, sir.
690. I mean any general officer?
- No, sir.
691. Or director?
- No, sir.
692. Was there anybody aboard representing the British Government?
- Not to my knowledge, sir.
693. Were there any other officers of any other White Star Line boats?
- No, sir
694. After the final test, what was done with the boat?
- We proceeded toward Southampton.
695. Immediately?
- Almost immediately after taking on board a few things that had been left behind, which were required for the completion of the ship.
696. What?
- So far as I know, requisites down in the galley, cooking apparatus, a few chairs, and such things as that.
697. Was the life-saving equipment -
- Oh, no, sir; nothing like that.
698. Was the life-saving equipment complete?
- Yes, sir.
699. Of what did it consist?
- The necessary number of lifeboats.
700. I wish you would say how that is determined, if you can.
- By the number of people on board.
701. You do not know how many there are on board until you are ready to start?
- No sir.
702. Is it not determined by the number of accommodations rather than by the number of people who get aboard?
- There must be life-saving apparatus for every one on board, regardless of accommodations.
703. Yes; but what I desire to know is whether in each stateroom on each deck, in all classes, whether there is any rule, and whether it was followed at that time, so far as you know, in equipping this boat with life preservers and lifebelts and anything else that might appropriately go into the rooms and be upon the decks of a boat of that character?
- She was perfectly complete throughout, sir.
704. How many lifeboats were there?
- Sixteen.
705. All of the same type?
- Consisting of 14 lifeboats, 2 emergency boats, and 4 collapsible boats.
706. Tell us whether they were new entirely.
- Entirely new.
707. And in their proper places?
- In their proper places.
708. With the necessary lowering apparatus?
- Everything complete, examined by the officers of the ship.
709. Was a test of the lifeboats made before you sailed for Southampton?
- All the gear was tested.
710. Were the lifeboats lowered?
- Yes, sir.
711. Under whose orders?
- The officers, principally my orders.
712. Under your orders?
- Yes.
713. Did you see the work done?
- I did.
714. Tell just what was done.
- All the boats on the ship were swung out and those that I required were lowered down as far as I wanted them - some all the way down, and some dropped into the water.
715. I wish you would give the proportion that went into the water.
- About six.
716. Six into the water?
- Yes.
717. And the others lowered?
- Part of the way - as far as I thought necessary.
718. Part of the way?
- Yes.
719. Of course, part of the way would not do anybody much good on a sinking ship. I assume you did that for the purpose of trying the gear, and not for the purpose of testing the security of the lifeboats?
- It is principally the gear that we test. The lifeboats we know to be all right.
720. These boats were lowered from what deck?
- From the boat deck.
721. Is that the sun deck?
- That is the top deck.
722. Do you know how far it was from that top deck to the water?
- Seventy feet.
723. What time did you reach Southampton?
- About midnight.
724. Of what night?
- I could not say.
725. Think it over.
- I think it was the morning of the 4th of April.
726. What makes you think it was the morning of the 4th?
- Because we sailed on the 10th.
727. How long did it take to make the run to Southampton?
- About 24 hours.
728. Did you strike any heavy weather?
- No, sir.
729. How fast did you go?
- About 18 knots.
730. What was done when you reached Southampton?
- The ship was heeled for stability.
731. Just describe that.
- The builders knowing the exact weights on board, additional weights are placed on each side of the ship. A pendulum is suspended in the most convenient place in the ship with a plumb on the end of it, and a method of registering the difference with the plumb line; a number of men then transfer the weights from one side of the ship to the other, bringing all the weight on one side and transferring the whole of it back again; and with this, I believe the builders are able to draw up a stability scale.
732. From what part of the ship are these tests made?
- The weights carried over, you mean?
733. Yes. From the upper part?
- The "C" deck - the third deck down.
734. About the center of the ship?
- Not quite the center of the ship.
735. Were there any tests made from the upper deck?
- Not that I know of, sir.
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